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Old 03-22-2019, 04:09 AM   #11 (permalink)
Ria
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That vivarium sounds perfect !! Its a very much used viv. The che set up, you need a holder and cage that screws in to the wood so you screw it to the middle of the top of the viv. Like in the picture. Also you need 100-150w holder and bulb. I'd just like casually mention it to you mum, to make sure she knows !! It would be horrible having to send it back to replace it.

Tictac is very common in the UK compared to CSB wheel. The savic wheel is a bery grey area due to the ridges, but they are smooth and rounded they cause no problems.

Sand baths are good, prorep do dessert sand, you need the one thats not got added calcium. The dessert sand is basically sand thats been filltered with nothing added, making it perfectly safe for out hedgehogs !! You can get it on amazon, or northhampton reptile centre its cheaper on there actually- order it on ther website, its also a great place to get insects from. Theres a picture of the bag if sand too.
Chinchilla sand is a very grey area, as in the UK you mainly just find chichilla dust, and even the sand is way too dusty now.
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Old 03-22-2019, 04:29 AM   #12 (permalink)
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You sure we're not talking about the same bun?? My girl, Bailey, is also allergic to hay - and when the vet said it was the cause of her sneezing, I couldn't believe what I was hearing. She's not allowed hay racks or hay bags because she will literally inhale it, and even the slightest bit sets her off - but she LOVES hay. I thought I was the only one with a bun allergic to one of the most important things she needs in life!

Anyways, not to go off-topic haha; TicTac wheels do not sell sand, as far as I can see; they sell chinchilla dust, which is not the same as chinchilla sand. Dust is much, much finer and is known to cause problems in many species that otherwise require sand baths (hamsters and gerbils in particular), and I wouldn't recommend using dust for a hedgehog.

Sand however, is perfectly safe. And there is much anecdotal evidence (you're not gonna find much scientific literature on hedgehogs, unfortunately) to suggest it's benefits. They will actively roll around in the sand to clean themselves, and it aids in removing any dirt/faeces from quills & toes. It can also help with dry skin, which hedgehogs are notorious for - it is so much better (and much more natural) than bathing your hog in water. For whatever reason, it is a heavily debate topic in the english communities - but in Germany, and much of Europe, offering a hedgehog a sand bath is generally considered a must; it's how they clean themselves, so they should be offered one. Reports you hear of a hedgehog losing its eye to sand baths, or male parts getting clogged... are probably as common as walking down the street and getting killed by a piano falling from the sky. In short; the risk to using a high quality chinchilla sand (not dust) for an otherwise healthy hedgehog are pretty much next to non-existent; they come from a sandy terrain in the wild, and they know what sand is haha. This is my favourite brand that I use for my hedgehog (I've also been in the natural hamster community for 5-6 years now, and never has a problem with it) and it's also used for hedgehogs by other folk I know too.

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Old 03-22-2019, 04:40 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Its only a huge debate because in the uk sand isnt very easily found. The main sand is reptile sand and kids play sand. Our chichilla sand that is easy to find and get is pretty much dust now. We are more likely to get dust than sand.
The UK DOES know there are benefits, and although they dont say its a must a lot of good owners do try to encourage it. They dont suggest it to new owners as they end up buying chicnilla dust even though it was labbeled as sand.

In the end you live in Ireland where you have more chance of finding chichilla sand, where as in the UK especially around London, its almost impossible to find good chinchilla sand, and if you type it into anywhere the main thing that comes up is chichilla dust.
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Old 03-22-2019, 06:04 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Its only a huge debate because in the uk sand isnt very easily found. The main sand is reptile sand and kids play sand. Our chichilla sand that is easy to find and get is pretty much dust now. We are more likely to get dust than sand.
The UK DOES know there are benefits, and although they dont say its a must a lot of good owners do try to encourage it. They dont suggest it to new owners as they end up buying chicnilla dust even though it was labbeled as sand.

In the end you live in Ireland where you have more chance of finding chichilla sand, where as in the UK especially around London, its almost impossible to find good chinchilla sand, and if you type it into anywhere the main thing that comes up is chichilla dust.
Sand is very easily found in the UK; again, its used by hamster owners - there's one forum in the UK (hamster central) that is one of the largest forums going. Finding sand is not an issue; there are several online stores that stock several high quality brands - the site I linked above is Zooplus, and that particular version of the store is UK-based. I don't think it's an issue of it being hard to find... more so being more of an issue that people are overwhelmed with brand choice, and/or don't know which brands to look for; which is a whole other problem altogether.

When I say English communities, I'm referring to english-speaking communities - not solely the UK (so dont take offence haha), but Irish (yes!), American, Canadian, you get the picture. And from what I've seen on here, there is some fear-mongering with sand... but perhaps you've experience differently, thats just been *my* personal experience.

I'm also not too sure where you got the assumption that Ireland has easier to find sand than the UK haha. Our situations are likely very similar - if not worse, Irish standards of pet care are very poor, and the pet shops here reflect it. In anyway; I dont shop in pet shops (because I prefer to not give them by business) and use online stores pretty much exclusively - so if you want high quality sand, Zooplus are very popular and ship throughout Europe. i also know some hamster owners use sand from Rodipet (german based, but they have an english site and also ship throughout the EU) - I havent used it personally, just because I've always used the zooplus option and love it, but I know of hamster owners use them - and they also have very sensitive upper respiratory systems, so cannot use poor quality sand/dust. Rodipet list their sands as dust, but i believe its just a translation issue; you could always ask some folk on hamster forums (hamster central) what their opinion/thoughts/experience using those sands where if you wanted to; they'd likely be more than happy to help you, and are very experienced in the world of sand.
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Old 03-22-2019, 07:07 AM   #15 (permalink)
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I wasnt taking offense, but I do know that in the UK they do try to get people to use sand baths, but for new owners dont try as much as they always seem to end up buying dust, even when given a specific type - God knows how.

From what I've read about chinchila sand every where in the UK its not good - This is just what I was told from a UK forum on hedgehogs.
I am in a UK hamster group and even they dont seem to like chichilla sand, and most suggestions given was buy play sand and then bake it, or buy reptile sand thats got nothing added to it.

I was also told its easier to find chinchilla sand in Ireland, but I'll take your word for it that its not.

The link wasnt loading through my data, so I couldnt see the sand. However I did see a post about it somewhere else (UK based) asking if its safe for their hog, and loads of people said it was but its a lot more dusty than it used to be and that its not the best to use they would be better using something else.

Sand like reptile sand, and kids play sand is a whole lot easier to find than chiclilla sand, especially as some of the newer "sands" labebled and sold as sand are actually mostly dust.
Ordering it online from some places may well be easier to find. But from what I keep being told (by Uk hedgehog forums and UK hamster forums) is that chichilla sand isnt ery good at all.

Last edited by Ria; 03-22-2019 at 07:12 AM.
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Old 03-22-2019, 07:44 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Hamster facebook groups - and this applies across the board, not just the UK - tend to be, eh... iffy, for lack of a better term. The actual forums - like hamster central - are 100 times better and less... close-minded? I guess - IMO, anyway. Facebook groups tend to be very "my-way-or-the-highway" and very reluctant to new information, which is an incredibly dangerous way to be as a pet owner.

In anyway; you'd be pretttttyyyy hard done by to come across a hamster owner who advises against all chinchilla sands, period. Chinchilla play sand tends to be very course, and doesn't do a good job at cleaning their coat. Chinchilla sand is finer, thus softer, and does a far better job at cleaning up greasy hamsters. Not to say that childrens play sand doesn't work, but chinchilla sand is far superior. All hamster owners will agree that there are better brands that others - sure isnt that how it is for everything! - but I've been in this (hamster) community for a while; and I've never known anyone (knowledgeable on the species) to claim all chinchilla sand must be avoided at all costs. It's sand; there will always be some level of dust (with chinchilla sand, with play sand, and certainly with reptile sand) - but some are far less dustier than others, and should pose absolutely no health risk to the average, healthy animal. The brand I linked has a very consistent quality, so I'm not sure who or where is saying otherwise haha. I've used it for several years now, and it is used in large areas of all of my hamsters enclosures (I'm not home right now, but just as a reference; example) and never once had a problem. Of course, me not having a problem doesn't mean its safe - but I know of several owners who use this brand, and who use it for almost the entire enclosure for the roborovski species especially, and I think the fact that none of us have had problems... surely must mean something. Coco has had it since November, and also no problems reported thus far - I'm perfectly comfortable with recommending it.

Ultimately use what you're most comfortable with using; I'm just saying that theres no need to be fearful of chinchilla sand once its from a brand known to have a consistent high quality.
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Old 03-22-2019, 08:37 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Unless they are saying it because most will just go to pets at home and buy whatever is ther - Which is generaly the dust they never seem to have the sand.
So they just tell people that chichilla sand cant beused to stop that ??
I'm not really sure, its just that every group and forum I've asked on, dont seem to like chinchilla sand at all.

I'm not saying its bad dont get me wrong, because I've never used any so I cant really talk from experiences on it. But from what everyone has said they are all dusty and all not good.

I am going off what I've been told, and the pictures people have shown me of differnt types - which have always looked more like dust than sand especialy compared to what you have shown.
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Old 03-22-2019, 06:45 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Just in response to the comment that you can’t find that brand chinchilla sand in the UK/London I buy it on amazon or at pets at home in London frequently. I’ve never found it any harder to get then any other hedgehog supplies.
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Old 03-22-2019, 07:40 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by akitka View Post
Just in response to the comment that you can’t find that brand chinchilla sand in the UK/London I buy it on amazon or at pets at home in London frequently. I’ve never found it any harder to get then any other hedgehog supplies.
Okay maybe its just really hard where I live then, problem is my mum is like "Anything you want amazon I'll buy it for you" because its easier for her to make one big order to the house (most buying my lazy brothers things) and then half the time she doesnt get what I wanted her to. And every time I go to pets at home they only have dust there, I ask staff and they just dont seem to stock the sand in my local one. I looked on their website to try and order it, got so far and then said I cant oder it.
So perhaps its just really hard for me and no one else🤷‍♀️
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Old 03-23-2019, 05:39 PM   #20 (permalink)
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I casually mentioned the cage and heating I was going to use at dinner with my Mum today and she fessed up to what she'd bought me to double check it was all okay! The heating set that's going to be pre-installed is a 200w komodo ceramic holder, a 100w exoterra ceramic bulb and microclimate B2 thermostat- Are these any good?

I'm glad to see I'm not the only one with a Bunny allergic to the essentials haha!

I'll be honest, I didn't know there was a difference between sand and dust so thank you both for telling me! I always used that EXACT chinchilla sand for my hamsters from zooplus by recommendation so I had no idea there was a 'dust' variant.
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